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Re: Advantage huds [message #366266 is a reply to message #366262] Wed, 07 January 2009 00:46 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
R315r4z0r is currently offline  R315r4z0r
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NukeIt15:

So let me make sure I've got this straight- mods which "just" alter the game to make actions quicker and easier shouldn't be considered cheats?

No, that isn't what I said. A HUD that makes an irrelevant action a fraction of a second, if anything faster than someone else shouldn't be considered a cheat.

NukeIt15:

That half-second isn't splitting hairs- it is a moment of vulnerability which is eliminated if you download an augmented HUD.

No, it's splitting hairs. There is no vulnerability gained at all! What's the difference in being able to simultaneously play and check a mine limit in 1 second than simultaneously play and check a mine limit in .5 seconds? There IS NO difference. You may have knowledge .5 seconds earlier than anyone else, but your character in the game can only move at one speed.

Scenario time:
In a 3v3 game. You mine in only 1 spot. You are at the far side of the base when you decide to check the mine limit.
1. While running around, you bring up the C4 menu, notice the C4 is low, and run to investigate
2. While running around, you glance at the counter, notice it is low, and run to investigate.

In both scenarios, you will arrive at the scene at the same time due to the reason you are running at the same speed. Thus, any information you manage to get .5 seconds earlier than anyone else, if any, means nothing because you are going to take the same amount of time to get to the location to investigate.

I'll put it another way. You are in a car that has about a half-mile of gas left in it. The nearest station is 2 miles. What would be the difference in the result of you finding out you had low fuel by glancing down at the gauge or by some sort of automated voice telling you low fuel? There would be no difference in the end result because you aren't going to make it to the station regardless.

To put it simply. I downloaded this HUD and absolutely nothing has changed in my play style or in the results of a match I play in. I read my screen with peripheral vision and quick split second glances.

The way I check up on my base's structures is by rapidly pressing the K (or is it J?) key. Doing that lets me take the quick flashes of the menu to see what building is under attack and it also allows me to keep moving while I check it.

The way I used to check C4 was by pressing the "/" key on my keyboard (my !C4 key binding), without looking mind you, and then glancing at what the count is at the top of the screen. What is the difference or advantage I gain in me looking at the bottom of the screen than on the top of the screen?

And not only that, but I still use the !C4 command to do things such as double check the mine count on the HUD and check remotes & times.

But lets just forget this whole discussion about the time it takes you to have this 'advantage' and lets focus on exactly what this 'advantage' is. What is it exactly? What advantage is clearly given to someone using a HUD that shows a mine count over someone who doesn't? What am I going to do with a mine count to make it unfair against my opponents? In a game with 20 people on each team? 10? 5?

There is no game-altering advantage given at all, not in the least.

NukeIt15:

At what point, do you think, does a mod to make things more convenient begin to give one player an edge over another? How much of an edge does it have to give that player before it is considered unfair?

Enough of an edge to send a shiver of imbalance through the game. Something that gives you the upper hand. Something that you have access to that everyone else doesn't. That's what I would consider to be unfair.

For example, if you had infinite ammo. Or some sort of way of detecting where enemy troops near you are. Or had faster bullet projectiles than other people. Or larger models making it easier to hit others. Or some sort of sound that alerted you when an enemy entered a structure or when an enemy places C4. Or brightly colored C4. Ect, ect, ect.

Those are advantages. Having the ability to check something irrelevant to your battle plot a quarter of a second, if any, faster than another person is not what I would consider an unfair advantage. By definition it is an advantage, but it isn't what would be an unfair advantage.

[Updated on: Wed, 07 January 2009 00:53]

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