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Could It Work? [message #48058]

Thu, 18 September 2003 19:15

Speedy059
Messages: 367
Registered: August 2003

Karma: 0

Commander

Posting this off of my forum from a guy named "Crix".

Quote:

what if someone installed renegade to a differrent folder then how would it scan? i know its easy to copy the renegade folder to another location, then uninstall the original. then the registry keys are no longer there to point to the renegade folder. in other words, you could put renegade in C:\program files\games\renegade and have cheats in there, because it will only scan C:\westwood\renegade\data for cheats (provided the directory still exists) and it wont detect any cheats because the directory will be empty. in other words, in a few clicks anyone can get around renguard. hmm and then all the other cons makes this program inefficient.

Could that be done? Or has the RenGuard team already solved that problem.

Oldest Renegade Repository (10yrs worth of maps!)
http://renegade.dmehosting.com/

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Could It Work? [message #48060]

Thu, 18 September 2003 19:17

Crimson
Messages: 7429
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Karma: 0

General (5 Stars)
ADMINISTRATOR

We already took that into consideration. Not my place to reveal how though. Smile

Smile

I'm the bawss.

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Could It Work? [message #49346]

Sat, 27 September 2003 02:54

ShadowFalls
Messages: 29
Registered: September 2003

Karma: 0

Recruit

thats pretty much easy really, a quick registry check will reveal where its located, same thing is used for game patches

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Could It Work? [message #49348]

Sat, 27 September 2003 03:02

Majiin Vegeta
Messages: 2186
Registered: February 2003
Location: London

Karma: 0

General (2 Stars)

heh tell them it will pass it.. and then when they join they get kicked.. and we can have a laugh.. O_o

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Could It Work? [message #49356]

Sat, 27 September 2003 05:37

destruktv
Messages: 14
Registered: September 2003

Karma: 0

Recruit

A very basic appriach, any script kiddie would try that first Smile

Smile

. I'd be surprised if the Renguard team had not covered that. The best way to check what the directory of the (executing) Renegade process is, is ofcourse in its runtime state.

CreateProcess(LPCWSTR lpszImageName, LPCWSTR lpszCmdLine,
LPSECURITY_ATTRIBUTES lpsaProcess, LPSECURITY_ATTRIBUTES lpsaThread, BOOL fInheritHandles, DWORD fdwCreate, LPVOID lpvEnvironment, LPWSTR lpszCurDir, LPSTARTUPINFOW lpsiStartInfo,
LPPROCESS_INFORMATION lppiProcInfo);

The above API function's first parameter by default when windows creates a process specifies the full path and filename of the module (executable) to execute.
This parameter can easily be checked to determine (running) Renegade's directory.

Ofcourse there are other issues that need to be considered even after that, but to bypass this, we already require some skills that most "lame kids who cheat" don't have.

Cheers,
D.

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Could It Work? [message #49730]

Mon, 29 September 2003 13:37

fl00d3d
Messages: 1107
Registered: August 2003
Location: Iowa, USA

Karma: 0

General (1 Star)
Viva la Resistance!

turn-on-cheats.bat

echo off
cls
echo.
echo.
echo. This batchs moves the cheats into the directory after RenGuard scans it.
echo.
echo.
move c:\westwood\renegade\data\temp\cheat.* c:\westwood\renegade\data
echo.
echo.
prompt $p$g

HOW ARE WE GETTING AROUND SOMETHING LIKE THIS?
AND WHAT ABOUT LEGAL MODS?

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Could It Work? [message #49741]

Mon, 29 September 2003 14:50

Crimson
Messages: 7429
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Karma: 0

General (5 Stars)
ADMINISTRATOR

Yes, we are dumb enough to scan only once. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

I'm the bawss.

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Could It Work? [message #49743]

Mon, 29 September 2003 14:53

Cadet1288
Messages: 23
Registered: September 2003
Location: The Boonies, Virgina, USA...

Karma: 0

Recruit

Does no one have faith in the Renguard project?! Come on guys. I'm sure the Renguard Team has gotten opinions from people who know this stuff.

All Out Extravaganza Moderator (NightmaDS)

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Could It Work? [message #49744]

Mon, 29 September 2003 14:56

Crimson
Messages: 7429
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Karma: 0

General (5 Stars)
ADMINISTRATOR

Either that or the RenGuard people ARE the people who know this stuff. I know most of the team has fucked around with Renegade quite a bit.

I'm the bawss.

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Could It Work? [message #49809]

Mon, 29 September 2003 16:50

EnderGate
Messages: 97
Registered: August 2003
Location: Ontario, Canada

Karma: 0

Recruit

I truly hope the RenGuard team doesn't have to entertain much of these questions, rather, expend their though on the development of this solution instead. Especially since many of these questions have already been answered in other posts.

However, if Crimson continues directing you to these answers then she is doing her part to preserve the RenGuard Team�s time and thought processes on the matter�

Let us be sure our questions haven�t already been addressed before starting another thread?

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Could It Work? [message #49829]

Mon, 29 September 2003 17:26

Blazer
Messages: 3322
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Karma: 0

General (3 Stars)
Administrator/General

fl00d3d

turn-on-cheats.bat

echo off
cls
echo.
echo.
echo. This batchs moves the cheats into the directory after RenGuard scans it.
echo.
echo.
move c:\westwood\renegade\data\temp\cheat.* c:\westwood\renegade\data
echo.
echo.
prompt $p$g

HOW ARE WE GETTING AROUND SOMETHING LIKE THIS?
AND WHAT ABOUT LEGAL MODS?

There is more than one scan, and its possible to tell the difference between a legal mod and a cheating one. For instance the w3d file can be checked and characteristics of the meshes/vertices etc examined. So, its possible to tell the diference between a different head, and a "big head" which would have a large hitter box area.

ALL of the cheats currently being done are simple file manipulations, dropping edited files into game path. RenGuard will not only stop this but will also discern between "safe" modified files and bad ones.

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Could It Work? [message #49833]

Mon, 29 September 2003 17:29

Crimson
Messages: 7429
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Karma: 0

General (5 Stars)
ADMINISTRATOR

EnderGate

I truly hope the RenGuard team doesn't have to entertain much of these questions, rather, expend their though on the development of this solution instead. Especially since many of these questions have already been answered in other posts.

However, if Crimson continues directing you to these answers then she is doing her part to preserve the RenGuard Team�s time and thought processes on the matter�

Let us be sure our questions haven�t already been addressed before starting another thread?

Yes, I understand how they're doing this and how it works, I just don't yet have the expertise to code it myself. I do know the developers are a couple steps ahead of many of you and have already covered ways to get around it that you haven't even thought of yet. Smile

Smile

I'm the bawss.

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Could It Work? [message #50325]

Fri, 03 October 2003 07:27

minsche
Messages: 1
Registered: October 2003

Karma: 0

Recruit

I have faith in professional coding and hope renguard will
be a success. But I was put off a little, when diodeone
claimed that it would not work. I know and have read all
your responses to this sort of statement, so you don�t need
to tell me again, but anyhow, I was amazed that somebody
like him (always top ten) would say something like that...

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Could It Work? [message #51364]

Tue, 14 October 2003 18:15

htmlgod
Messages: 360
Registered: July 2003

Karma: 0

Commander

Quote:

RenGuard will not only stop this but will also discern between "safe" modified files and bad ones.

That should be interesting..... A program that analyzes my skins and models and decides whether they're "safe" or "bad." How?

Seems like quite a task, I mean how does one define a "bad" model or skin? And then, how does one write a program that detemines whether models/skins meet the requirements? Is Big Brother watching?

Check out http://newhope.conquergaming.com to see the progress of the STARWARS mod for Renegade.

http://newhope.conquergaming.com/OtherStuff/NIKE.jpg

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Could It Work? [message #51378]

Tue, 14 October 2003 18:46

Blazer
Messages: 3322
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Karma: 0

General (3 Stars)
Administrator/General

htmlgod

Seems like quite a task, I mean how does one define a "bad" model or skin? And then, how does one write a program that detemines whether models/skins meet the requirements? Is Big Brother watching?

Because of the nature of w3d files. They are not simply image files, they also contain information such as the vertice points and dimensional data, and my checking this its possible to tell that you have a different head on a model, but not a "big head" or that the hitbox is within normal parameters. It is also possible to tell if a file is fan made or WS made (the game developers tools put something in the files that the fan tools do not). Big brother isn't watching, just reading the data that is allready there Smile

Smile

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Could It Work? [message #51459]

Wed, 15 October 2003 11:07

fl00d3d
Messages: 1107
Registered: August 2003
Location: Iowa, USA

Karma: 0

General (1 Star)
Viva la Resistance!

Just to verify:

No one has a legal copy of the source code for Renegade or the FDS, correct? I'm assuming that would be a violation of copyrights and many other things? Curious.

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Could It Work? [message #51487]

Wed, 15 October 2003 14:19

Crimson
Messages: 7429
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Karma: 0

General (5 Stars)
ADMINISTRATOR

If someone had a "legal" copy of the source code, it wouldn't be a violation of anything. What a contradiction in terms!

And who said ANYTHING about having source code?

I'm the bawss.

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