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something you may not know [message #425544] Mon, 12 April 2010 17:14 Go to next message
crazfulla is currently offline  crazfulla
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Colonel
I was away from ren for ages, I come back and start playing on n00bless where I was a moderator once (until Hex threw a hissy fit because of something I said). I notice a few people getting odd weapons and shit but I dont think much of it. I mean, a sbh with a volt autorifle? Not likely, but possible.

Anyway it was later brought to my attention that certain moderators and people who contribute financially towards the server(s) were being given certain privies. For starters, they get 30% discounts on all purchases at the PT. This is regardless of promotion level (I think you can get upto 15% discount by being promoted). Anyways, also, they can use exclusive commands to get free weapons and vehicles, and god knows what else (I don't even want to know).

What really amazes me is that some people at n00bless actually think this is acceptable, and make a feeble attempt to defend Hex. If you ask me, this is essentially cheating, and it is a tad ironic for mods to be using these commands when their job is to remove cheaters. IMO Anyone who impliments or uses such commands is a fucking scumbag and not worthy of moderating or administering a server.

I also know that I am not the only person to feel this way. Several people at n00bless are sick of those commands but are too shit scared to say anything. I think that the public has a right to know about this, I don't anticipate this is something that Hex would spread widely. I mean, he always seems to have some comeback to everything, but not this. Thus far he seems to be completely avoiding the issue.

So if he will not discuss it, I shall discuss it with the wider renegade community. What are your thoughts? Am I just over reacting? or is this truely a new low? Tell Me

vent over.


"GEoDLeto wrote:"

so what you are saying it is gonna take even longer before this thing is finished
So the topic title should be changed to: a sucky little "teaser" from C&C Reborn has been released

"halo2pac wrote:"

Unless they are girls, I am not going to bone them.
Re: something you may not know [message #425545 is a reply to message #425544] Mon, 12 April 2010 17:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
InternetThug is currently offline  InternetThug
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While I believe that is bullshit, I must say that if those people are too scared to say something and play there anyways, nothing is really going to change. You might aswell find a new server for the time being.
Re: something you may not know [message #425546 is a reply to message #425544] Mon, 12 April 2010 17:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DRNG is currently offline  DRNG
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If you contribute to a server financially you don't deserve special powers. Nobody does, not even the owner. Unless you are a moderator or admin, which in that case your powers should be limited to removing cheaters, douchebags and keeping the server in a good state.

It's Renegade. Nobody should be given special discounts, super weapons or powers alike. I am sure players there are playing there for a fun gaming experience, not advantages to those who gave a buck or two.

However, it's not my server. I don't make the rules, they do. If you don't like the server you can leave it and find another one. Thumbs Up

[Updated on: Mon, 12 April 2010 17:32]

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Re: something you may not know [message #425548 is a reply to message #425544] Mon, 12 April 2010 17:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
R315r4z0r is currently offline  R315r4z0r
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Seriously? I think it's actually a really good idea.

I mean, there is obviously a line between doing something that is a flat out ridiculous cheat and something that rewards donators.

I think that the PT discounts is actually a very good way of rewarding a donator. I think the max discount should be like 5-10%, however.

Other good rewards could be like special server commands (like sounds and stuff), special server appearances (like those floating icons that some servers have over characters), and other superficial things.

Obviously things like free weapons and stuff isn't a good idea, but that isn't to say that there can't be things that reward people who donate money.

Overall, I think that this concept of rewarding the people who care enough to donate to a server is an excellent way to:
-Keep a strong, loyal community
-Encourage server donation
-Make the game experience more dynamic

However, I also believe that these rewards should not be limited to just those who donate money. People who donate their time and effort should also reap benefits. (Advertising, creating banners and logos, keeping regular server attendance, etc)

[Updated on: Mon, 12 April 2010 17:48]

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Re: something you may not know [message #425554 is a reply to message #425544] Mon, 12 April 2010 18:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
crazfulla is currently offline  crazfulla
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Colonel
Note: I don't mind them giving some reward to donators.
The problem is that this reward is an unfair advantage.


"GEoDLeto wrote:"

so what you are saying it is gonna take even longer before this thing is finished
So the topic title should be changed to: a sucky little "teaser" from C&C Reborn has been released

"halo2pac wrote:"

Unless they are girls, I am not going to bone them.
Re: something you may not know [message #425557 is a reply to message #425554] Mon, 12 April 2010 18:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zeratul is currently offline  zeratul
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n00bless doesn't like me

Re: something you may not know [message #425569 is a reply to message #425544] Mon, 12 April 2010 20:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
a000clown
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The only reward for donations should be self-satisfaction. Expecting something out of a donation is basically extortion.

I'm not saying what n00bless is doing is wrong, servers do cost quite a bit of money; I just think everybody should stop hiding behind "nice" words and call it exactly what it is: a commodity to be sold.

That said, I see nothing wrong with selling special advantages for a price (whether that price is real money or time spent moderating/maintaining the server is irrelevant). If you don't like it, simply don't play there.

Although I see nothing wrong with what they're doing from a moral standpoint, my personal preference is that all players are completely equal (which also means no custom client changes such as skins but that's for a different thread).
Re: something you may not know [message #425576 is a reply to message #425544] Mon, 12 April 2010 23:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
raven
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If you don't like it, don't play there.. simple concept people seem to not understand time and time again

Don't go on a crusade against Hex and n00bless on Renforums.. just stop playing there


-Jelly Administrator
-Exodus Administrator

[Updated on: Mon, 12 April 2010 23:31]

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Re: something you may not know [message #425578 is a reply to message #425569] Mon, 12 April 2010 23:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Goztow is currently offline  Goztow
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a000clown wrote on Tue, 13 April 2010 05:36

The only reward for donations should be self-satisfaction. Expecting something out of a donation is basically extortion.

I'm not saying what n00bless is doing is wrong, servers do cost quite a bit of money; I just think everybody should stop hiding behind "nice" words and call it exactly what it is: a commodity to be sold.

That said, I see nothing wrong with selling special advantages for a price (whether that price is real money or time spent moderating/maintaining the server is irrelevant). If you don't like it, simply don't play there.

Although I see nothing wrong with what they're doing from a moral standpoint, my personal preference is that all players are completely equal (which also means no custom client changes such as skins but that's for a different thread).

I think I have to agree with the clown. 30 % does seem a lot of an advantage... I personally prefer it when everyone is equal.


You can find me in The KOSs2 (TK2) discord while I'm playing. Feel free to come and say hi! TK2 discord
Re: something you may not know [message #425586 is a reply to message #425544] Tue, 13 April 2010 04:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
SSADMVR is currently offline  SSADMVR
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I once got banned from N00bless within 5 minutes of joining.
Re: something you may not know [message #425587 is a reply to message #425544] Tue, 13 April 2010 04:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
reborn is currently offline  reborn
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It's their server, they can do what they want.

If players don't like it, they don't have to play there. No need to go calling them out about it.

I also Once considered this, but instead of "buffs" such as this, I was going to allow commands to allow donators a limited amount of uses of !SetNextMap <map name> and other commands that do not directly effect gameplay.

There's obviously a market for it, so some people like the idea.



Re: something you may not know [message #425629 is a reply to message #425576] Tue, 13 April 2010 17:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
HaTe is currently offline  HaTe
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raven wrote on Tue, 13 April 2010 01:31

If you don't like it, don't play there.. simple concept people seem to not understand time and time again

Don't go on a crusade against Hex and n00bless on Renforums.. just stop playing there

This. I'm not for the whole donating advantage thing, but if they NEED donations to keep the server alive, what the hell else are they supposed to do? It's a good idea, it just doesn't turn out well for the average player who doesn't donate. Win-lose situation, and no need to complain about it Whats That .


http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t263/psuHaTe32_2007/HaTe3.jpg
‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’ - Edmund Burke
Re: something you may not know [message #425635 is a reply to message #425569] Tue, 13 April 2010 17:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
R315r4z0r is currently offline  R315r4z0r
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a000clown wrote on Mon, 12 April 2010 23:36

The only reward for donations should be self-satisfaction. Expecting something out of a donation is basically extortion.

That doesn't make any sense. In fact, its insulting the way you put it.

How is the rewarder expecting anything out of the rewarded?

If I ran a server, how is me giving a reward to people who donate to the server translate into them expecting a reward? Why should MY thank you gift be considered extortion on THEIR part?

The server owners are giving the people who donate rewards of THEIR own free will. The people who donate aren't expecting a thing unless it was advertised that they would get something.
Re: something you may not know [message #425637 is a reply to message #425635] Tue, 13 April 2010 17:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
HaTe is currently offline  HaTe
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Well, I'm sure that many of the people who donated knew about the little upgrade they would get...whether they cared or not. So it was advertised in it's own way really, after people see that people were getting advantages after donating. I also highly doubt it was kept a secret from public entirely, as that would defeat the purpose entirely.

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t263/psuHaTe32_2007/HaTe3.jpg
‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’ - Edmund Burke

[Updated on: Tue, 13 April 2010 17:32]

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Re: something you may not know [message #425640 is a reply to message #425637] Tue, 13 April 2010 17:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zeratul is currently offline  zeratul
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HaTe wrote on Tue, 13 April 2010 18:32

people see that people were getting advantages after donating. I also highly doubt it was kept a secret from public entirely, as that would defeat the purpose entirely.

this was still a terrible approach even when it is not openly told to everyone.... this is the best example i have

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qb0vquRcys

as an explanation

basically its like...
1q. would you like to play in our server?
1a. yea (is not told about donation and does not stumble across)
1q. (gives normal gameplay)

2q. would you like to play in our server?
2a. yea (is told about OR stumbles across donation)
2q. (gives normal gameplay plus extra for donation)

in the end i hope you get the idea


Re: something you may not know [message #425642 is a reply to message #425640] Tue, 13 April 2010 17:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
HaTe is currently offline  HaTe
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So you are saying they should advertise it BETTER? I don't necessarily have an opinion on that, because i can't tell you for sure how well it is advertised in the first place; I don't generally ever play there, so i don't know if the advantages are worth the complaining. It really sounds like the topic starter was not pissed off at the fact he was not told about the donation advantage, but was however angry that the donaters received the advantages in the first place.

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t263/psuHaTe32_2007/HaTe3.jpg
‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’ - Edmund Burke
Re: something you may not know [message #425643 is a reply to message #425640] Tue, 13 April 2010 17:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DRNG is currently offline  DRNG
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Zeratul wrote on Tue, 13 April 2010 19:38

HaTe wrote on Tue, 13 April 2010 18:32

people see that people were getting advantages after donating. I also highly doubt it was kept a secret from public entirely, as that would defeat the purpose entirely.

this was still a terrible approach even when it is not openly told to everyone.... this is the best example i have

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qb0vquRcys

as an explanation

basically its like...
1q. would you like to play in our server?
1a. yea (is not told about donation and does not stumble across)
1q. (gives normal gameplay)

2q. would you like to play in our server?
2a. yea (is told about OR stumbles across donation)
2q. (gives normal gameplay plus extra for donation)

in the end i hope you get the idea


That was enjoyable because I have seen that on television. Thumbs Up
Re: something you may not know [message #425646 is a reply to message #425642] Tue, 13 April 2010 17:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zeratul is currently offline  zeratul
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HaTe wrote on Tue, 13 April 2010 18:44

but was however angry that the donaters received the advantages in the first place.

thats a good point but at least an advertisement would (in his case) be an ahead warning... and at the same time remove the ones who complain about not being told...(two birds with one stone?)


Re: something you may not know [message #425648 is a reply to message #425646] Tue, 13 April 2010 17:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
HaTe is currently offline  HaTe
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Well, it sounds like it was advertised somehow eventually, based on the fact that craz knew the exact advantages (Given, he may have done research).

He did however say:
Quote:

Anyway it was later brought to my attention that certain moderators and people who contribute financially towards the server(s) were being given certain privies.

Which of course gives the assumption that if someone was smart enough to figure out something fishy was going on, then they could have found out what exactly it was.

I wouldn't mind it being in the message pop-up at beginning of game, if it is not already. Though, i could care less anyways.


http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t263/psuHaTe32_2007/HaTe3.jpg
‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’ - Edmund Burke
Re: something you may not know [message #425649 is a reply to message #425648] Tue, 13 April 2010 17:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zeratul is currently offline  zeratul
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HaTe wrote on Tue, 13 April 2010 18:50

Well, it sounds like it was advertised somehow eventually, based on the fact that craz knew the exact advantages (Given, he may have done research).

He did however say:
Quote:

Anyway it was later brought to my attention that certain moderators and people who contribute financially towards the server(s) were being given certain privies.

Which of course gives the assumption that if someone was smart enough to figure out something fishy was going on, then they could have found out what exactly it was.

I wouldn't mind it being in the message pop-up at beginning of game, if it is not already. Though, i could care less anyways.

i think in the end a debate over this is pointless.... i dont think really anyone should care if a pop up is provided.... in the end if you dont like the server... be it people, shitty mods, or advantages...

PLAY IN A DIFFERENT SERVER


Re: something you may not know [message #425650 is a reply to message #425649] Tue, 13 April 2010 17:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
HaTe is currently offline  HaTe
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Agreed. Which is exactly what i do, and exactly why i don't play there hardly at all. Actually, drama about a community generally raises the average play count in the server....even when the drama is about something as dumb as this. So it's actually helping n00bless in the long run Huh .

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t263/psuHaTe32_2007/HaTe3.jpg
‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’ - Edmund Burke

[Updated on: Tue, 13 April 2010 17:56]

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Re: something you may not know [message #425651 is a reply to message #425650] Tue, 13 April 2010 18:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zeratul is currently offline  zeratul
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HaTe wrote on Tue, 13 April 2010 18:56

Agreed. Which is exactly what i do, and exactly why i don't play there hardly at all. Actually, drama about a community generally raises the average play count in the server....even when the drama is about something as dumb as this. So it's actually helping n00bless in the long run Huh .

i did the same when i was banned from n00bless, unjust this time, i never did notice the advantages though.... course i was to busy having fun to give a shit..... i'd say this topic is pointless to continue?


Re: something you may not know [message #425655 is a reply to message #425544] Tue, 13 April 2010 18:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
liquidv2 is currently offline  liquidv2
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this clown guy knows what he's talking about
i was going to say exactly what he said but in much lesser words

on st0rm if you're a higher rank you can do more things than lesser ranked players, like buy unavailable weapons and do commands that they cannot
it's just a way to attract players or get them to play more
or in Hex's case, sway them towards donating

a few people getting vehicles sooner probably won't ruin every game but it may decide more than a few, so it's probably not the greatest idea he's ever had

like they said, play somewhere else if he doesn't feel like changing it Razz


liquidv2
Re: something you may not know [message #425668 is a reply to message #425544] Tue, 13 April 2010 19:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dr3w2 is currently offline  dr3w2
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I agree with what most people have said here. Basically, "unfair add-ons for special/donating members are acceptable as long as it's well known to the players who play there. If you don't agree, don't play there".

Luv2pb I should totally start progressing again on that lovely project Wink


n00bstories Server Administrator

[Updated on: Tue, 13 April 2010 19:50]

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Re: something you may not know [message #425670 is a reply to message #425668] Tue, 13 April 2010 20:06 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
zeratul is currently offline  zeratul
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andr3w282 wrote on Tue, 13 April 2010 20:48

"unfair add-ons for special/donating members are acceptable as long as it's well known to the players who play there. If you don't agree, don't play there".

entire thread summed up in one sentence Thumbs Up Big Ups Thumbs Up


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