Home » General Discussions » Heated Discussions and Debates » Treatment of convicted cheaters
| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237716 is a reply to message #237654] |
Sat, 06 January 2007 23:46   |
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Spoony
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| Crimson wrote on Sat, 06 January 2007 19:50 |
I'm sure he wants the names and IPs of SS so they can ban him, too. He goes by JohnDoe on here.
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Names he commonly plays by (as far as clanwars goes)
H2Hitler
JohnDoe
JohnDough
IP: Not helping you on this one.
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237738 is a reply to message #237554] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 04:17 |
puddle_splasher
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| MexPirate wrote on Sat, 06 January 2007 08:28 |
I really couldn't give a shit what players who do not play in the league think on the matter as it has nothing to do with them and it doesn't affect them.
Also don't forget that players can simply refuse to play games against certain players if they wish - I won't play against robo or baller because I don't think they should be playing, you don't have the same power to choose your opponents in a public game. If you feel SS should be banned, don't play him and allow others to make their own judgement.
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What a BULLSHIT statement. It affects everyone and has everything to do with us.
Without Joe Public reporting to you, the cheats will have an even bigger field to play on. We, the public suffer at the hands of the cheat as much as anyone else.
As regards leaving a game/server, thats a joke. Now you want me to lie down and accept that there will still be known cheats amongst us. When they play, using an alias and we dont know its them, do you still want me to leave the game because at that rate I will be leaving almost every game as someone shouts "They are cheating" and all because it may be the cheat using an alias.
Once a cheat, always a cheat, regardless of who and how long they have been cheat free.
They cant resist the chance to see if they can control it. Every addiction is like that and cheating is no different.
The control lies with the Server Admin.
Permanent ban for all cheats convicted with proof, that is beyond reasonable doubt.
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237739 is a reply to message #237738] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 04:36 |
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Spoony
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| puddle_splasher wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 06:17 |
The control lies with the Server Admin.
Permanent ban for all cheats convicted with proof, that is beyond reasonable doubt.
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I agree, but many servers overlook the 'proof' part - thus, non-cheaters being banned too.
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237743 is a reply to message #237740] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 05:00 |
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Spoony
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The policy at Clanwars.cc is that IPs are to be used only by admins for the purposes of moderating the leagues, and not given to someone outside of the league's chain of command. I intend to adhere to that policy. If you want me to give you a complete list of every warrior name he has used for clan matches, I will. But I am not giving you his IP.
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237745 is a reply to message #237504] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 05:11 |
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Crimson
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The BlackIntel guys caught him using: CRlMSON:217.233.247.24
I was able to use that IP to link him to his forum account here ("JohnDoe"). I'm not sure if he's changed it yet or not.
Edit: They also showed this proof:
| EvilWhiteDragon wrote on Sat, 23 December 2006 05:47 |
| Quote: |
[21/12/06 16:53:57] Host: Potential cheat detected: Blocked 10000.000000 damage with warhead 13 from player CRlMSON (21).
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Our anti cheat system logged this for like 424 times, and it all got blocked  (now he would have bee banned after the first time, but since we didnt have that feature then he could try it more often  )
Also Username and ip:
CRlMSON:217.233.247.24
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I'm the bawss.
[Updated on: Sun, 07 January 2007 05:12] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237747 is a reply to message #237504] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 05:22 |
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Sniper_De7
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If you were to ban every person that's cheated once, you'd probably have a significantly smaller population then you would have now. In fact, for the people who actually *know* how to find and download them, I'd say I would be probably in the less than 50% who haven't decided to try it. I'm not dumb enough to go and ruin everybody's game just for the sake of my having fun. Besides, I've had enough trouble as it is with server moderators thinking I cheat, testing me/or not even testing me, and even after they test me, and I pass, I still get banned.
Last time I checked (a couple months ago) I was still banned on the KOSs server. Reasonable since i was banned until RG 1.04 (I laughed at this because I knew that it pretty much meant I was banned permanently) Then I later got banned from like 2 other servers because *they* labeled me a cheater by banning me, without any proof. Not only that, but me and the person who got banned unrightfully, have caught moderators that were cheating before (not KOSs's, I'm just saying that it'd be a little weird for a person to cheat and then go and catch cheaters by using our own time to prove it, when it's not our job but the servers). Hell, I've caught a few public people cheating and frapsed them and told server moderators.
In n00bless, where I caught one of the cheaters, I took a video and it was pretty conclusive proof that the person in question did more damage then he was supposed to. It's not too common you see someone doing 10.5 damage with a GDI rifle, is it? And 52.5 for headshots. However, that wasn't proof enough that the guy cheated I guess. It's a lot more proof than what i've always been banned on, which is none...
You'd think that also cheating when you're a moderator is the worst thing to do, considering the fact that the whole purpose of a moderator is to *uphold* rules, and that would be like telling the server moderators that you will not break them. So you'd think punishments would be worse than the average joe blow who cheats. But that'd be a perfect world.
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
[Updated on: Sun, 07 January 2007 05:27] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237756 is a reply to message #237738] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 05:39 |
MexPirate
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| puddle_splasher wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 05:17 |
| MexPirate wrote on Sat, 06 January 2007 08:28 |
I really couldn't give a shit what players who do not play in the league think on the matter as it has nothing to do with them and it doesn't affect them.
Also don't forget that players can simply refuse to play games against certain players if they wish - I won't play against robo or baller because I don't think they should be playing, you don't have the same power to choose your opponents in a public game. If you feel SS should be banned, don't play him and allow others to make their own judgement.
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What a BULLSHIT statement. It affects everyone and has everything to do with us.
Without Joe Public reporting to you, the cheats will have an even bigger field to play on. We, the public suffer at the hands of the cheat as much as anyone else.
As regards leaving a game/server, thats a joke. Now you want me to lie down and accept that there will still be known cheats amongst us. When they play, using an alias and we dont know its them, do you still want me to leave the game because at that rate I will be leaving almost every game as someone shouts "They are cheating" and all because it may be the cheat using an alias.
Once a cheat, always a cheat, regardless of who and how long they have been cheat free.
They cant resist the chance to see if they can control it. Every addiction is like that and cheating is no different.
The control lies with the Server Admin.
Permanent ban for all cheats convicted with proof, that is beyond reasonable doubt.
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Christ you are a fucking moron how does a players participation in the cw.cc league affect you?
you are unlikely to run in to SS in a public server anyway, pretty sure 90% would ban him without the cheats cos he would straight rape everyone, he prefers to play against people who actually have some level of skill.
It's a mexican pirate .... F*ck a dog by Blink 182
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237761 is a reply to message #237504] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 05:48 |
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Goztow
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Not to mention he has a huge ego and attitude problem which would already convince a lot of server moderators to ban him.
You can find me in The KOSs2 (TK2) discord while I'm playing. Feel free to come and say hi! TK2 discord
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237762 is a reply to message #237504] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 05:48 |
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Sniper_De7
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I'm not arguing with you. Your server was just one of the best cases of unfairness. Though, I think I've also been banned twice after doing a test and passing it, and that's a bit more retarded. I think that's equally as dumb as not even going through and testing people, as you don't seem fond of doing. I'd rather have a person who was prooved a cheater than just banning on instinct and hoping the person was cheating and then you can go and tell other servers that the person was *Proven* to be a cheater. It gives the people who were banned and weren't cheating some credibility to at least know they were willing to test. It's up to the moderators to figure out what kind of cheat they were using. The fact that I asked over and over again what you guys thought I was using so that I could have at least seen if it was able to be tested. If you thought I was using a cheat that was was possible to test, and prove i was a cheater, I don't really see why you wouldn't want to do that. But as was already said before, you didn't say anything. The only thing you said was that you had a gut feeling. That's fine I guess, but a gut feeling that... getting too many headshots?/doing more damage/etc.
The sad part about it is that after RG 1.04 comes out, if it does (Don't get your hopes up people), that people will still be banned without proof. The minute people start shouting "Bypass!" is when it'll just happen all over again.
I don't really care about being banned anymore, obviously I've lived with it, and I find it more funny that i'm still banned than I am mad about it. The average cheater would have just changed his IP and went cheating again.
Edit: Have you played in clanwars and against a clan like H20? I know you've played GW. Does it still seem a bit strange that there could be people out there that are even *better* than us? (me and mrp)
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
[Updated on: Sun, 07 January 2007 05:51] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237763 is a reply to message #237762] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 05:51 |
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Crimson
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| Sniper_De7 wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 05:48 |
The sad part about it is that after RG 1.04 comes out, if it does (Don't get your hopes up people)
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Oh it WILL come out, no matter what I have to do to get it.
I'm the bawss.
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237764 is a reply to message #237504] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 05:54 |
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Sniper_De7
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Is this where I ask when?
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237767 is a reply to message #237504] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 06:16 |
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Crimson
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I can't tell you when. I fucking wish I could. I'm probably just going to throw money at the problem like I always end up doing.
I'm the bawss.
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237779 is a reply to message #237504] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 07:17 |
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Goztow
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| Quote: |
Edit: Have you played in clanwars and against a clan like H20? I know you've played GW. Does it still seem a bit strange that there could be people out there that are even *better* than us? (me and mrp)
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Strange that you ask: we played GW and got owned obviously. But not once we thought they were cheating. They were much faster and strategically superior but they didn't make a crazy amount of HS's/damage.
You can find me in The KOSs2 (TK2) discord while I'm playing. Feel free to come and say hi! TK2 discord
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237781 is a reply to message #237756] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 07:44 |
puddle_splasher
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| MexPirate wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 06:39 |
| puddle_splasher wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 05:17 |
| MexPirate wrote on Sat, 06 January 2007 08:28 |
I really couldn't give a shit what players who do not play in the league think on the matter as it has nothing to do with them and it doesn't affect them.
Also don't forget that players can simply refuse to play games against certain players if they wish - I won't play against robo or baller because I don't think they should be playing, you don't have the same power to choose your opponents in a public game. If you feel SS should be banned, don't play him and allow others to make their own judgement.
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What a BULLSHIT statement. It affects everyone and has everything to do with us.
Without Joe Public reporting to you, the cheats will have an even bigger field to play on. We, the public suffer at the hands of the cheat as much as anyone else.
As regards leaving a game/server, thats a joke. Now you want me to lie down and accept that there will still be known cheats amongst us. When they play, using an alias and we dont know its them, do you still want me to leave the game because at that rate I will be leaving almost every game as someone shouts "They are cheating" and all because it may be the cheat using an alias.
Once a cheat, always a cheat, regardless of who and how long they have been cheat free.
They cant resist the chance to see if they can control it. Every addiction is like that and cheating is no different.
The control lies with the Server Admin.
Permanent ban for all cheats convicted with proof, that is beyond reasonable doubt.
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Christ you are a fucking moron how does a players participation in the cw.cc league affect you?
you are unlikely to run in to SS in a public server anyway, pretty sure 90% would ban him without the cheats cos he would straight rape everyone, he prefers to play against people who actually have some level of skill.
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I am that player with the skill, without cheating, you fucking moron 
It affects us more than you think but you are so fucking stupid to comprehend that thought, even if its 10% of a number, that you plucked out of thin air, its still cheating.
One cheat, one kill, one vehicle loss, can inadvertantly change the game.
But again you are so self-righteous towards the cheats that all I see is you agreeing with them.
You Sir, as the saying goes, are the moron.
Cheat, get caught, have evidence, permanent ban. Thats so simple a 5 year old can understand it.
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237786 is a reply to message #237781] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 08:29 |
MexPirate
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| puddle_splasher wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 08:44 |
I am that player with the skill, without cheating, you fucking moron
It affects us more than you think but you are so fucking stupid to comprehend that thought, even if its 10% of a number, that you plucked out of thin air, its still cheating.
One cheat, one kill, one vehicle loss, can inadvertantly change the game.
But again you are so self-righteous towards the cheats that all I see is you agreeing with them.
You Sir, as the saying goes, are the moron.
Cheat, get caught, have evidence, permanent ban. Thats so simple a 5 year old can understand it.
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Good for you, glad you are so pro and don't need the cheats, do you actually play on the cw.cc league? I am assuming not, please correct me if I am wrong.
Perhaps you should read and understand what you quote before talking a load of bullshit, my point is that people who DO NOT use the league should have no say on how it is run, how does someone being BANNED FROM THE LEAGUE affect someone who only plays in public servers?
This isn't a topic about public servers, it is about banning people FROM THE LEAGUE, there is no dispute that someone cheating in a pulic server should get a ban in that server and any other at the server owners discretion - but I think you missed the whole point of the thread because you were busy being self righteous.
Unless you play on cw.cc ladder - your opinion means exactly jack shit to the people that do when it comes to how the league is run.
It's a mexican pirate .... F*ck a dog by Blink 182
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237795 is a reply to message #237779] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 09:47 |
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Sniper_De7
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| Goztow wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 08:17 |
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Edit: Have you played in clanwars and against a clan like H20? I know you've played GW. Does it still seem a bit strange that there could be people out there that are even *better* than us? (me and mrp)
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Strange that you ask: we played GW and got owned obviously. But not once we thought they were cheating. They were much faster and strategically superior but they didn't make a crazy amount of HS's/damage.
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So what, out of the time you were infantry versing them, not once did you get killed easily? You can't exactly talk about 'faster" or "strategics" in a public when you're only one guy. I mean a clanwar is about 80% tanks so it's not like you have a full affect, but besides GW are good and everything, but they aren't the best. the top clanwars people play tons of clanwars each month and have that much more practice.
But what, Did you think that I did a "crazy" amount of headshots? As far as I remember I didn't even do that well, i think I had terrible FPS because I left IE on and didn't remember to turn it off. Not to mention I was mostly in a vehicle if i remember... Except on snow, where i body shotted that ref guy where he banned me afterwards.
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237798 is a reply to message #237795] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 10:13 |
MexPirate
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| Sniper_De7 wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 10:47 |
where i body shotted that ref guy where he banned me afterwards.
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/me bites lip till it bleeds.
It's a mexican pirate .... F*ck a dog by Blink 182
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237844 is a reply to message #237504] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 16:59 |
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Crimson
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Well, I think you guys are missing Fl00d3d's point. His opinion is that by allowing someone who (indisputedly) cheated in a few public servers to still compete in their league paints the league in a bad light. He also feels that when the representatives and members of the league say that "We don't give a shit about public servers because there is no skill there" further paints the league in a bad light for people who might have been considering joining said league. In his (and maybe others) opinion, it makes people question the legitimacy of the league when "convicted" cheaters are allowed to participate. I don't think anyone expects those of us who don't participate in the league to give a shit about who is or isn't allowed to compete in it. Fl00d3d's concern was for the league, not for those of us outside of it.
I'm the bawss.
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237873 is a reply to message #237844] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 22:10 |
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Spoony
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| Crimson wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 15:59 |
Well, I think you guys are missing Fl00d3d's point. His opinion is that by allowing someone who (indisputedly) cheated in a few public servers to still compete in their league paints the league in a bad light. He also feels that when the representatives and members of the league say that "We don't give a shit about public servers because there is no skill there" further paints the league in a bad light for people who might have been considering joining said league. In his (and maybe others) opinion, it makes people question the legitimacy of the league when "convicted" cheaters are allowed to participate. I don't think anyone expects those of us who don't participate in the league to give a shit about who is or isn't allowed to compete in it. Fl00d3d's concern was for the league, not for those of us outside of it.
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1. The only official representative of the Clanwars.cc league is me, and I've made it perfectly clear that we take a dim view of cheating even outside of league matches, to the extent of dishing out forum suspensions.
2. "He also feels that when the representatives and members of the league say that "We don't give a shit about public servers because there is no skill there"" - again, *I*, the only official representative who has posted on the subject, said no such thing. The difference between you and I is I am capable of handling my official projects in a mature, unbiased, and uncorrupt way.
3. Look at all the sad, pathetic little wretches on this forum you've issued no penalty whatsoever to... 0x90, Slavik453, Kholdstare... yourself... do you think SS comes close to being as pathetic as any of those? I've made it clear Clanwars.cc does not support SS's actions and will penalise league players for it. You won't lift a finger about 0x90 because "it won't stop him making cheats". You won't lift a finger about Kholdstare ddosing your own moderators in your own server because, well, we've already been through the whole "pet bulldog" thing and the fact you find it useful to be on his good side.
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Renedrama [ren-i-drah-muh]
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1. the inevitable criticism one receives after doing something awful
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| Re: Treatment of convicted cheaters [message #237877 is a reply to message #237876] |
Sun, 07 January 2007 22:37 |
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Spoony
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Attacking you? Wow.
Unleash the Renerageâ„¢
Renedrama [ren-i-drah-muh]
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1. the inevitable criticism one receives after doing something awful
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