Home » Renegade Discussions » Tactics and Strategies » Using free soldiers
| Using free soldiers [message #181767] |
Fri, 09 December 2005 08:54  |
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m1a1_abrams
Messages: 375
Registered: August 2003
Karma: 0
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The Patch thread reminded me about the free rifle soldiers on both sides, and how hardly anyone seems to use them effectively. Obviously you get lots of them running to the middle of the map at the very start of the game while they're waiting for cash to buy something better, but after that they rarely get used. The thing is though, they're free and totally expendable, but do good damage to infantry and light vehicles. They even get a lot of points from shooting heavy armoured vehicles, although it's quite a cheap tactic when they're doing next to no damage.
Like I said, they're expendable and do good damage, so there's no good reason not to head out and find something to shoot at if you can't afford a tank yet. It's better than paying for a mid-range character and taking longer to get enough credits for your tank + giving the enemy points when you get killed. I guess a lot of people are hung up on their k/d ratio, which is a shame, because you're helping the team more by softening up an Artillery with a GDI Soldier, rather than just sitting there waiting for credits. You even gain credits faster by shooting things, and it's not difficult to get a free soldier killed when you have enough for whatever you want to buy.
There are so many situations where free soldiers can be a great help to the team. For example, if the map is Field and your team is danger of losing the middle ground, then all the people who aren't tanks or Hotwires/Technicians could be shooting at the MRLS/Artillery with free soldiers. They will have a really poor survival rate, but you lose nothing by getting out there. On the other hand, your team gains another unit doing good damage to the light armoured vehicles, and another unit for the enemy to shoot... hopefully distracting them from focus-firing on your tanks. It's win-win... if they're smart and keep shooting the tanks then at least you will do some damage of your own with the rifle soldier, and if they shoot you then you're limiting how much damage your own vehicles take. Also, when your base if being terrorized by Orcas/Apaches, don't hide inside your buildings... get out there with your free soldier and shoot at them. Aircraft go down so quickly to concentrated rifle fire that you don't necessarily need snipers to deal with them. Sure you will die fast if you get targeted, but you're gonna respawn in your base ready to go again and they gain practically nothing by killing you. You get lots of points for your team by damaging them and even better, you might help take down some aircraft.
I'm not trying to say that rifle soldiers are the best unit, or that you should keep them when you could buy something a lot better... all I'm saying is that if you're chiefly interested in winning games rather than your k/d ratio, then you'd be a fool not to use the free soldier while you wait for your credits to come through. I really wish people weren't so bothered about dying in the game. From the point of view of trying to win, the only time dying matters is when you lose more points to the enemy than your team gains while your character is alive.
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181771 is a reply to message #181767] |
Fri, 09 December 2005 10:15  |
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Sniper_De7
Messages: 866
Registered: April 2004
Location: Wisconsin
Karma: 0
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I wouldn't include the nod soldier. the only thing they're really good at would be to getting points (if you needed it)
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181779 is a reply to message #181767] |
Fri, 09 December 2005 12:53 |
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Sniper_De7
Messages: 866
Registered: April 2004
Location: Wisconsin
Karma: 0
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Colonel |
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Trust me, I have been in that situation plenty of times; most notably on Walls_Flying. It's a lot more dangerous to be on the receiving end of like 5+ GDI soldiers than it would be for 5 Nod ones. In fact I would rather it be Nod soldiers since they hardly do much at all. But in the case of Field (as you stated) The Nod soldiers aren't even able to shoot at the MRLS that would (under normal circumstances) be at the other end of the map. While the artillery would easily be in range from inside their base. Like I said, if you want money that's the way to do it but don't rely on it helping much. Even the Nod buggy is weaker than the GDI humvee which means the GDI do more damage against it and it has less HP. While the Nod soldiers do less damage and has to fighter a stronger unit. You'll probably only seeing me use a Nod soldier if i really needed money or if I was out a Refinery (Since even the flamethrower isn't great at getting money against buildings compared to the grenadier)
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181784 is a reply to message #181767] |
Fri, 09 December 2005 13:47 |
MrWiggles
Messages: 231
Registered: October 2005
Location: CANADADA
Karma: 0
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nod shooters are also WAY easier to kill. and dont forget you stop getting massive points from shooter fucking vehicles once their health drops below half.
im best rene
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181793 is a reply to message #181767] |
Fri, 09 December 2005 16:15 |
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Sniper_De7
Messages: 866
Registered: April 2004
Location: Wisconsin
Karma: 0
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Colonel |
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Don't think so, I do believe the Nod APC is bigger and thus you miss less. People don't usually realize how much they're missing in APCs
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181797 is a reply to message #181767] |
Fri, 09 December 2005 16:59 |
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Lijitsu
Messages: 1575
Registered: April 2005
Location: Georgia, USA
Karma: 0
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General (1 Star) |
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The Flamethrower and Shotgunner are extremely useful to Nod. The Flamethrower can take more tank splash than any other character, because of their flame-retardent suits, plus they do a good amount of damage to vehicles and make any player panic. Get a group of four Flamethrower troopers and send them at an enemy vehicle, even a Mammoth, and, as long as there are no snipers and the troopers aren't idiots, they're mostly assured in atleast making the vehicle back off. They work best if you can ambush vehicles, but running straight at one(In a sense.) is effective aswell.
The Shotgunner does more damage to the lightly armored vehicles and infantry than any other basic unit, save the Engineer. Sneak up on an MRLS group, plant C4 on one of them, and start shooting at another. Usually they either back away or start firing, sometimes both. This frees up a small amount of time that your base isn't getting hammered, which can save a building or two. Plus the one with the C4 on it will be destroyed if it goes off, causing them to lose around 500 Credits, and an Artillery unit.
The Nod basic soldier is very effective as a distraction, just like M1A1 said. Send in one or two as the main fighting force with tanks waiting around a corner, wait 'till the enemy troops start shooting at them, and bring in the tanks. It may not seem to effect the enemy, but look at it this way: Infantry don't have unlimited ammunition. They gotta run out sometime.
| Aircraftkiller wrote on Wed, 31 May 2006 22:30 |
I've been Nodbuggered. =( =( =(
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181884 is a reply to message #181767] |
Sat, 10 December 2005 13:20 |
=HT=T-Bird
Messages: 712
Registered: June 2005
Karma: 0
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Colonel |
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Another wiki-worthy post for m1a1_abrams! Keep up the good work, m8!
HTT-Bird (IRC)
HTTBird (WOL)
Proud HazTeam Lieutenant.
BlackIntel Coder & Moderator.
If you have trouble running BIATCH on your FDS, have some questions about a BIATCH message or log entry, or think that BIATCH spit out a false positive, PLEASE contact the BlackIntel coding team and avoid wasting the time of others.
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181912 is a reply to message #181767] |
Sat, 10 December 2005 17:32 |
karmai
Messages: 319
Registered: September 2004
Karma: 0
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Gdi soldiers work great, nod meh not so much. You're almost always better off with an engineer than a soldier if you're on nod.
and correcting whoever said it earlier..
nod shooters do 10 damage a headshot, gdi shooters do 25.. Thats a big difference.
And the reason you made this thread was from the comment i made in the patch thread, but patch is only on gdi.. I made that comment saying use a gdi soldier to kill snipers
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181918 is a reply to message #181767] |
Sat, 10 December 2005 17:59 |
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Sniper_De7
Messages: 866
Registered: April 2004
Location: Wisconsin
Karma: 0
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Colonel |
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gdi: 35*/ headshot 7*/anything else
nod: 25*/ headshot 5*/anything else
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181945 is a reply to message #181912] |
Sun, 11 December 2005 05:44 |
Spoony_old
Messages: 1105
Registered: December 2004
Karma: 0
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General (1 Star) |
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| karmai wrote on Sat, 10 December 2005 19:32 |
and correcting whoever said it earlier..
nod shooters do 10 damage a headshot, gdi shooters do 25.. Thats a big difference.
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he was closer to the mark than you...
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181955 is a reply to message #181767] |
Sun, 11 December 2005 06:39 |
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m1a1_abrams
Messages: 375
Registered: August 2003
Karma: 0
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Commander |
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Personally I don't agree with all this talk about the player always being better off with a Nod Engineer/Flamethrower/Shotgunner. The range of the automatic rifle is more important than you're making out. The other free Nod troops have short range weapons and it's not always possible to close down the distance. In specific situations (depending on the terrain cover etc.), then of course a different character could do the job better, but that doesn't make the Nod Soldier worthless. Actually I'd say there are more instances where you could make use of the rifle guy than the other three. The heavily contested and generally more important areas of the Renegade maps tend to be dominated by open space, in which case the other free guys are going to be spending more time trying to get in range than hurting anything (particularly vs vehicles).
Btw, I realise that enemy infantry do tend to favour the areas of cover. Obviously short ranged but more powerful weapons are going to shine here, but you are specifically hunting infantry in this instance. My point is that you can take a rifle soldier into the map and do some worthwhile damage to almost anything. When you're dealing with the unknown, rifle soldiers are a better choice out of the free characters.
[Updated on: Sun, 11 December 2005 06:40] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181961 is a reply to message #181767] |
Sun, 11 December 2005 09:34 |
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Sniper_De7
Messages: 866
Registered: April 2004
Location: Wisconsin
Karma: 0
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Colonel |
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They might be wide open but for the most part you can easily hide from them; whether it be a hill or a wall. The biggest place where you could use a nod soldier against an engee/gren/shotgun where they couldn't reach you would be field. the biggest advantage for using a pistol is that it's instant. So wherever you're aiming (the head, hopefully) you're going to hit. You only need 4 so if you're first behing some cover you can pop out before the guy knows you're there and get 12 (instant) shots that could very well at least take him down to half health (more if he was going in a straight line/whatever else) But still in pretty much all other scenarios the pistol will reach and if it can't; you can easily get behind cover until you can reach him
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #181962 is a reply to message #181767] |
Sun, 11 December 2005 10:47 |
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m1a1_abrams
Messages: 375
Registered: August 2003
Karma: 0
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Commander |
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Yeah, at close range a Nod Soldier will probably lose to something like a Shotgunner 1 on 1 assuming equal skill. I've never disputed that though. What I've been saying is that the rifle soldier on both sides is a good all round character that you can use to assist the team effort at any point in the game, while you're waiting for the credits to buy a tank/high class character. You can run out into the middle of the map and there is always going to be something that you can hurt, whether it's light armoured vehicles or infantry. You can decide which is the more important target and start shooting, because you will usually be in range from the start. You can't do that with a Shotgunner, or an Engineer, or a Flamethrower. All three have the potential to hurt both infantry and vehicles, but require careful use of terrain to get into range.
Basically what I'm saying is that yeah the GDI soldier is better, and yeah the other Nod free characters can also be better given the right circumstances, but the Nod soldier is still a generalist unit that's expendable and free. It's the only one Nod has and just because it doesn't do as much damage as the GDI version, it is still the best choice of free character when you have no particular target or enviroment in mind.
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #182068 is a reply to message #181767] |
Mon, 12 December 2005 06:14 |
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Goztow
Messages: 9738
Registered: March 2005
Location: Belgium
Karma: 13
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General (5 Stars)
Goztoe |
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usually pistol > rifle because most maps have points where you can hide / get cover. Also big range spraing = spray and pray most of the time.
You can find me in The KOSs2 (TK2) discord while I'm playing. Feel free to come and say hi! TK2 discord
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #182070 is a reply to message #181767] |
Mon, 12 December 2005 07:46 |
karmai
Messages: 319
Registered: September 2004
Karma: 0
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Recruit |
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well the reason a shotgunner isn't good is this..
what happens if you get into the other teams base with your shotgunner, you don't have any remote c4.. then you'll be wishing you had an engi... or if it's a base defence map, you'll be wishing you had an engi to either repair your harvester, or destroy theirs.
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| Re: Using free soldiers [message #182112 is a reply to message #181767] |
Tue, 13 December 2005 00:14 |
Spoony_old
Messages: 1105
Registered: December 2004
Karma: 0
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General (1 Star) |
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it also takes thirty seconds to go off... so unless nobody saw you, good luck with that... remote c4 is instant and you can kill yourself in the process
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