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Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types [message #178317 is a reply to message #178313]

Mon, 07 November 2005 18:43

NeoSaber
Messages: 336
Registered: February 2003

Karma:

Recruit

Arcane1 wrote on Mon, 07 November 2005 19:56

Being a living being, and being an entity that is capable of existing out of the womb are two different issues. Until a certain degree of maturity is accomplished, the zygote cum fetus is little more biologically than a parasite, feeding off of the Mother. By that definition, the Mother should have the right to terminate the relationship on her terms.

Yes, being a living being and being able to exist out of a womb are two different issues. Being completely self sufficient means nothing in the debate on whether something is alive. No one is self sufficient, as we all need to eat. Having to eat doesn't make an adult not a person. It's really a non-issue in what constitutes life.

A parasite latches onto a host and forcefully sucks out nutrients it needs to live. A fetus doesn't do this. The mother's body is designed to support and nourish it. The fetus can't sink its 'fangs' into the mother's body and suck out food. The mother's body has to send food to the fetus, or it dies. Like a new born baby is dependant on a caregiver, so is a preborn baby. If the baby was a parasite, the mother's immune system would attack it as a foreign invader, yet her body actually creates defense mechanisms to ensure its survival while it is still vulnerable to things like parasites and infections. The relationship is closer to being symbiotic than it is parasitic.

Even if we were to accept the idea that a fetus is a parasite, a parasite is still a living organism, and in this case its genetic code is that of a living human. Regardless if it was a parasite, its still a human. It is just at a stage in life where it's parasitic. It still has the right to live, as it is human genetically and humans have the right to life.

When it comes to the mother having a right to terminate the relationship, that's just ridiculous. Did the baby force itself into the mother? Of course not, the baby's parents forced it to exist in the first place, or in the case of rape, one of its parents forced it to be there. The baby never asked to be there to begin with and can't be held responsible for being there now. By allowing an abortion for this reason, you are punishing a child for the actions of a parent or parents. If anyone has a right to terminate the relationship its the fetus, as it was forced into the arrangement to begin with.

You might as well argue a slave master has the right to kill a slave if they no longer want to feed the slave. That argument would miss the whole point that slaves shouldn't be denied their freedom to begin with.

NeoSaber

Renegade Map Maker at CnC Source
Animator/Compiler/Level Editor/Object Rigger/Programmer for Red Alert: A Path Beyond

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[Message index]

		Abortion [split] By: cheesesoda on Sun, 06 November 2005 16:41
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Ryan3k on Sun, 06 November 2005 17:44
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: cheesesoda on Sun, 06 November 2005 18:12
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: swahbuckler on Sun, 06 November 2005 18:30
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Hydra on Sun, 06 November 2005 18:41
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: cheesesoda on Sun, 06 November 2005 18:49
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: swahbuckler on Sun, 06 November 2005 17:45
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Hydra on Sun, 06 November 2005 18:21
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: warranto on Sun, 06 November 2005 19:32
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: cheesesoda on Sun, 06 November 2005 19:48
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: warranto on Sun, 06 November 2005 20:12
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: cheesesoda on Sun, 06 November 2005 20:45
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: warranto on Mon, 07 November 2005 10:00
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Hydra on Sun, 06 November 2005 20:48
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Arcane1 on Sun, 06 November 2005 20:55
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Hydra on Sun, 06 November 2005 22:14
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: cheesesoda on Sun, 06 November 2005 22:16
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Dundasbro on Sun, 06 November 2005 22:57
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: cheesesoda on Sun, 06 November 2005 21:17
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Dundasbro on Sun, 06 November 2005 21:35
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Jecht on Sun, 06 November 2005 22:16
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: NeoSaber on Sun, 06 November 2005 23:32
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Hydra on Mon, 07 November 2005 01:40
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Jecht on Mon, 07 November 2005 08:17
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Crimson on Mon, 07 November 2005 10:38
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: NeoSaber on Mon, 07 November 2005 11:26
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: mrpirate on Mon, 07 November 2005 09:17
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Seeker on Mon, 07 November 2005 15:13
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Arcane1 on Mon, 07 November 2005 15:22
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: NeoSaber on Mon, 07 November 2005 16:30
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Hydra on Mon, 07 November 2005 16:42
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: cheesesoda on Mon, 07 November 2005 16:04
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: NukeIt15 on Mon, 07 November 2005 16:49
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Arcane1 on Mon, 07 November 2005 17:56
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Jecht on Mon, 07 November 2005 18:38
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: NeoSaber on Mon, 07 November 2005 18:43
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: NeoSaber on Mon, 07 November 2005 17:09
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Ryan3k on Mon, 07 November 2005 17:25
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Hydra on Mon, 07 November 2005 17:42
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Doitle on Tue, 08 November 2005 06:33
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Jecht on Tue, 08 November 2005 08:47
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Ryan3k on Tue, 08 November 2005 06:52
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Ryan3k on Tue, 08 November 2005 17:33
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Doitle on Tue, 08 November 2005 19:42
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: warranto on Wed, 09 November 2005 23:38
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: warranto on Tue, 08 November 2005 07:28
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: SuperFlyingEngi on Tue, 08 November 2005 15:45
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Jecht on Tue, 08 November 2005 15:47
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: SuperFlyingEngi on Tue, 08 November 2005 16:00
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: NukeIt15 on Tue, 08 November 2005 16:38
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Jecht on Tue, 08 November 2005 17:24
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Doitle on Tue, 08 November 2005 17:28
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: SuperFlyingEngi on Tue, 08 November 2005 18:00
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: NeoSaber on Tue, 08 November 2005 18:36
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: SuperFlyingEngi on Tue, 08 November 2005 19:45
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: NeoSaber on Tue, 08 November 2005 20:37
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Doitle on Tue, 08 November 2005 19:47
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: SuperFlyingEngi on Tue, 08 November 2005 19:56
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Doitle on Tue, 08 November 2005 19:58
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Crimson on Tue, 08 November 2005 20:03
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: SuperFlyingEngi on Tue, 08 November 2005 20:22
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Arcane1 on Wed, 09 November 2005 15:35
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: johny roberts on Wed, 09 November 2005 16:11
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Hydra on Wed, 09 November 2005 19:58
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: SuperFlyingEngi on Tue, 15 November 2005 15:59
		Re: I need some good Conservative/Republican types By: Arcane1 on Wed, 09 November 2005 23:33
		Re: Abortion [split] By: NeoSaber on Thu, 10 November 2005 01:09
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Thu, 10 November 2005 07:21
		Re: Abortion [split] By: NeoSaber on Thu, 10 November 2005 13:32
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Thu, 10 November 2005 16:10
		Re: Abortion [split] By: NeoSaber on Thu, 10 November 2005 17:16
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Kytten9 on Thu, 10 November 2005 02:10
		Re: Abortion [split] By: warranto on Thu, 10 November 2005 08:21
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Kytten9 on Thu, 10 November 2005 09:26
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Goztow on Thu, 10 November 2005 08:02
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Thu, 10 November 2005 16:04
		Re: Abortion [split] By: warranto on Thu, 10 November 2005 09:41
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Kytten9 on Thu, 10 November 2005 17:26
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Goztow on Thu, 10 November 2005 09:56
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Jecht on Thu, 10 November 2005 10:20
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Jecht on Thu, 10 November 2005 16:36
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Fri, 11 November 2005 14:10
		Re: Abortion [split] By: warranto on Thu, 10 November 2005 19:08
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Jecht on Thu, 10 November 2005 20:12
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Hydra on Thu, 10 November 2005 20:53
		Re: Abortion [split] By: cheesesoda on Thu, 10 November 2005 22:35
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Fri, 11 November 2005 14:26
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Jecht on Fri, 11 November 2005 15:09
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Fri, 11 November 2005 15:16
		Re: Abortion [split] By: cheesesoda on Fri, 11 November 2005 14:56
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Fri, 11 November 2005 15:13
		Re: Abortion [split] By: cheesesoda on Fri, 11 November 2005 16:20
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Hydra on Fri, 11 November 2005 20:17
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Sat, 12 November 2005 06:39
		Re: Abortion [split] By: cheesesoda on Sat, 12 November 2005 07:58
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Sat, 12 November 2005 21:58
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Jecht on Sat, 12 November 2005 22:13
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Hydra on Sun, 13 November 2005 00:43
		Re: Abortion [split] By: cheesesoda on Fri, 11 November 2005 21:24
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Sun, 13 November 2005 09:28
		Re: Abortion [split] By: NeoSaber on Sun, 13 November 2005 12:58
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Sun, 13 November 2005 13:39
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Hydra on Sun, 13 November 2005 11:04
		Re: Abortion [split] By: cheesesoda on Sun, 13 November 2005 11:28
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Aircraftkiller on Sun, 13 November 2005 13:17
		Re: Abortion [split] By: SuperFlyingEngi on Tue, 15 November 2005 16:03
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Javaxcx on Wed, 16 November 2005 11:49
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Hydra on Tue, 15 November 2005 21:15
		Re: Abortion [split] By: SuperFlyingEngi on Wed, 16 November 2005 16:11
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Thu, 17 November 2005 00:11
		Re: Abortion [split] By: cheesesoda on Thu, 17 November 2005 13:55
		Re: Abortion [split] By: SuperFlyingEngi on Thu, 17 November 2005 14:31
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Jecht on Wed, 16 November 2005 16:35
		Re: Abortion [split] By: SuperFlyingEngi on Wed, 16 November 2005 17:26
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Jecht on Wed, 16 November 2005 18:46
		Re: Abortion [split] By: SuperFlyingEngi on Wed, 16 November 2005 21:04
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Hydra on Thu, 17 November 2005 16:15
		Re: Abortion [split] By: SuperFlyingEngi on Thu, 17 November 2005 18:05
		Re: Abortion [split] By: Arcane1 on Sun, 20 November 2005 02:18

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