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| After Downing Street [message #162037] |
Tue, 28 June 2005 20:02  |
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SuperFlyingEngi
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Doubtlessly most of you haven't heard of the Downing Street Memos, because a majority of you don't know anything.
http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/dsmemo.pdf
They're a secret British document that got leaked by someone high up in the English government telling how facts of the Iraq war were being fixed around the case and that the Attorney General said the war in Iraq would be illegal given current evidence.
http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/
A site by David Swanson, a constitutional scholar calling for the impeachment of George W. Bush. Maybe you should look around.
Here's a letter to Rep. John Conyers, Jr. from John Bonifaz, another important item.
http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/?q=node/5
"One of the keys to being seen as a great leader is to be seen as a commander-in-chief. My father had all this political capital built up when he drove the Iraqis out of Kuwait and he wasted it. If I have a chance to invade·.if I had that much capital, I'm not going to waste it. I'm going to get everything passed that I want to get passed and I'm going to have a successful presidency."
-George W. Bush, 1999, talking to his ghost writer, Mickey Herrskowitz, who wrote A Charge To Keep.
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Theodore Roosevelt (1918)
"The danger to political dissent is acute where the Government attempts to act under so vague a concept as the power to protect "domestic security." Given the difficulty of defining the domestic security interest, the danger of abuse in acting to protect that interest becomes apparent. --U.S. Supreme Court decision (407 U.S. 297 (1972)
The Liberal Media At Work
An objective look at media partisanship
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162064 is a reply to message #162037] |
Tue, 28 June 2005 23:25  |
msgtpain
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I'm pretty sure we're the ones at fault here, as he said, the majority of us "don't know anything"...
I wish I was as smart as a 14 year old liberal tool.... one can only dream, I guess.
I guess the funniest thing is, in all the years we've been here, he still hasn't learned that he shouldn't start out a conversation with slander.. it just doesn't make good "conversation".
[Updated on: Tue, 28 June 2005 23:27] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162100 is a reply to message #162042] |
Wed, 29 June 2005 09:31 |
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SuperFlyingEngi
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| Doitle wrote on Tue, 28 June 2005 23:35 |
So a document outlaying the routes the US had for the Iraq War proves what? You guys don't have anything better to go on? The line "fixed around the issues" is your hail mary impeach Bush play? Unfuckinglikely.
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So you believe Iraq was being supplied with nuclear material from Africa?
So you believe that Saddam posed an imminent threat to the United States?
So you believe that Saddam harbored al Qaeda?
So you believe Iraq had WMDs? [http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/01/12/wmd.search/]
Of course, after it was found that there were no WMDs in Iraq, Bush's mission statement changed from
THIS: Bush: “Our mission is clear in Iraq. Should we have to go in, our mission is very clear: disarmament.” [3/6/03]
to THIS: Bush: “Our cause is just, the security of the nations we serve and the peace of the world. And our mission is clear, to disarm Iraq of weapons of mass destruction, to end Saddam Hussein’s support for terrorism, and to free the Iraqi people.” [3/22/03]
Oh, and a top war proponent Pentagon hawk [Richard Perle] has conceded that the war in Iraq was illegal. [http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/?q=node/505]
Guess what Nazi leaders like Goering, von Ribbentrop, Jodl, and Streicher were hanged for?
"(a) Crimes against Peace: namely, planning, preparation, initiation or waging of a war of aggression, or a war in violation of international treaties, agreements or assurances, or participation in a Common Plan or Conspiracy for the accomplishment of any of the foregoing"
-Article 6, Charter of the International Military Tribunal, August 8, 1945
And of course on the topic of Guantanamo and Abu Ghraib,
" War Crimes: namely, violations of the laws or customs of war. Such violations shall include, but not be limited to, murder, ill-treatment or deportation to slave labor or for any other purpose of civilian population of or in occupied territory, murder or ill-treatment of prisoners of war or persons on the seas, killing of hostages, plunder of public or private property, wanton destruction of cities, towns, or villages, or devastation not justified by military necessity"
-Article 6, Charter of the International Military Tribunal, August 8, 1945
So, you think a Republican Congress will pass a resolution of inquiry on this? Of course not. But it would be nice if we had a real government.
EDIT: Errors with text formatting
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Theodore Roosevelt (1918)
"The danger to political dissent is acute where the Government attempts to act under so vague a concept as the power to protect "domestic security." Given the difficulty of defining the domestic security interest, the danger of abuse in acting to protect that interest becomes apparent. --U.S. Supreme Court decision (407 U.S. 297 (1972)
The Liberal Media At Work
An objective look at media partisanship
[Updated on: Wed, 29 June 2005 09:32] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162113 is a reply to message #162037] |
Wed, 29 June 2005 11:05 |
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Jecht
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Im getting tired of repeating this:
The 3 reasons we were in Iraq:
1.) WMDs, Still pending. There is alot of fucking Desert out there
2.) Help the Iraqis gain independence from the Tyranny of Sadaam.
3.) Terrorist Ties, and don't tell me they aren't there because our troops get blown up everyday because of them. This is a war on TERROR not just on al Qaeda.
Also, playing loud music and Sleep deprivation is NOT mistreating prisoners. There was no physical Torture(that was approved of) of Prisoners.
[Updated on: Wed, 29 June 2005 11:06] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162117 is a reply to message #162113] |
Wed, 29 June 2005 11:27 |
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SuperFlyingEngi
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| gbull wrote on Wed, 29 June 2005 14:05 |
Im getting tired of repeating this:
The 3 reasons we were in Iraq:
1.) WMDs, Still pending. There is alot of fucking Desert out there
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No, not still pending. That search ended a long time ago. http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/01/12/wmd.search/
And this was the only reason given before the war was launched, rendering the other two irrelevant.
“Our mission is clear in Iraq. Should we have to go in, our mission is very clear: disarmament.” -George W. Bush [3/6/03]
| gbull |
2.) Help the Iraqis gain independence from the Tyranny of Sadaam.
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Humanitarian reasons aren't legitimate reasons to topple a sovereign nation's government.
| gbull |
3.) Terrorist Ties, and don't tell me they aren't there because our troops get blown up everyday because of them. This is a war on TERROR not just on al Qaeda.
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So you believe Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11? And, if I may, was Iraq harboring terrorists that proved an imminent threat to the safety of the United States?
| gbull |
Also, playing loud music and Sleep deprivation is NOT mistreating prisoners. There was no physical Torture(that was approved of) of Prisoners.
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Then why have captives in U.S. custody died as a result of trauma?
http://www.humanrightsfirst.org/us_law/etn/statements/abu-yr -042605.htm
http://www.cageprisoners.com/articles.php?id=4122
And the U.S. is planning an all-inclusive tribunal/death chamber set-up [http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/2979076.stm] absent from such non-sense as juries and the right to appeal.
And violating medical privacy rules in order to implement more effective per-person torture schemes. [ http://fullcoverage.yahoo.com/s/nm/20050623/hl_nm/security_g uantanamo_health_dc]
An FBI Agent says he saw it. [ http://cnnstudentnews.cnn.com/2004/US/12/08/guantanamo.abuse /]
It's more than just loud music. And loud music and sleep deprivation ARE mental torture techniques. You can make people literally insane with only the two.
EDIT: Errors with quotation system
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Theodore Roosevelt (1918)
"The danger to political dissent is acute where the Government attempts to act under so vague a concept as the power to protect "domestic security." Given the difficulty of defining the domestic security interest, the danger of abuse in acting to protect that interest becomes apparent. --U.S. Supreme Court decision (407 U.S. 297 (1972)
The Liberal Media At Work
An objective look at media partisanship
[Updated on: Wed, 29 June 2005 11:28] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162120 is a reply to message #162037] |
Wed, 29 June 2005 12:13 |
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Jecht
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I believe George W. said he was planning a war on Terrorism prior the war, and you can't add humanitarian reasons to the list? man...maybe we shoulda just stayed out of the European Theatre in WWII then, because Hitler wasnt an immediate threat to us. No ties to terrorism:
http://www.cfr.org/publication.php?id=7702
| "CFR Publications" |
What kind of support has Iraq given terrorists?
Safe haven, training, and financial support. In violation of international law, Iraq has also sheltered specific terrorists wanted by other countries, reportedly including:
* Abu Nidal, who, until he was found dead in Baghdad in August 2002, led an organization responsible for attacks that killed some 300 people.
* Palestine Liberation Front leader Abu Abbas, who was responsible for the 1985 hijacking of the Achille Lauro cruise ship in the Mediterranean. Abbas was captured by U.S. forces April 15.
* Two Saudis who hijacked a Saudi Arabian Airlines flight to Baghdad in 2000.
* Abdul Rahman Yasin, who is on the FBI's "most wanted terrorists" list for his alleged role in the 1993 World Trade Center bombing.
Iraq has also provided financial support for Palestinian terror groups, including Hamas, Islamic Jihad, the Palestine Liberation Front, and the Arab Liberation Front, and it channeled money to the families of Palestinian suicide bombers. In April 2002, Iraq increased the amount of such payments from $10,000 to $25,000. Experts say that by promoting Israeli-Palestinian violence, Saddam may have hoped to make it harder for the United States to win Arab support for a campaign against Iraq.
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| "CFR Publications" |
What ties have been alleged between Iraq and al-Qaeda?
In October 2002, CIA Director George Tenet announced that the CIA had received uncorroborated reports that:
* Senior-level contacts between Iraq and al-Qaeda stretch back a decade.
* Iraq and al-Qaeda have discussed the provision of safe havens and reciprocal nonaggression.
* Iraq has provided training to al-Qaeda members in chemical weapons and conventional explosives.
* Al-Qaeda leaders have tried to cultivate contacts in Iraq who could help them acquire weapons of mass destruction.
* Some al-Qaeda members who fled Afghanistan took refuge in Baghdad and elsewhere in Iraq.
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162121 is a reply to message #162119] |
Wed, 29 June 2005 12:31 |
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SuperFlyingEngi
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| Doitle wrote on Wed, 29 June 2005 15:09 |
Yes I beleive he was a threat, yes I beleive they were harboring terrorists, yes I beleive they had WMDs. We have a real government, we don't need an inquiry. Who the hell cares what the reasoning was. We are in Iraq. Iraq has a new government. Everything is peachy. I tell you we'd probably be years ahead of our time if it wasn't for all the whiners. We'd have cured cancer and colonized another planet probably. We're always held back though by everyone bitching and complaining. I am an American citizen. I don't care if their mission statement changed.
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How was Saddam a threat, which terrorists were they harboring, and why do you believe they had WMDs? BTW, are you suggesting the ends justify the means?
| gbull |
I believe George W. said he was planning a war on Terrorism prior the war, and you can't add humanitarian reasons to the list? man...maybe we shoulda just stayed out of the European Theatre in WWII then, because Hitler wasnt an immediate threat to us. No ties to terrorism:
http://www.cfr.org/publication.php?id=7702
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Hitler was an immediate threat to us, though, what with his being allied with Japan, Japan attacking us, and his attacking other countries in order to occupy them and kill non-Aryans. Saddam wasn't doing that.
| gbull |
"CFR Publications"
What kind of support has Iraq given terrorists?
Safe haven, training, and financial support. In violation of international law, Iraq has also sheltered specific terrorists wanted by other countries, reportedly* including:
* Abu Nidal, who, until he was found dead in Baghdad in August 2002, led an organization responsible for attacks that killed some 300 people.
* Palestine Liberation Front leader Abu Abbas, who was responsible for the 1985 hijacking of the Achille Lauro cruise ship in the Mediterranean. Abbas was captured by U.S. forces April 15.
* Two Saudis who hijacked a Saudi Arabian Airlines flight to Baghdad in 2000.
* Abdul Rahman Yasin, who is on the FBI's "most wanted terrorists" list for his alleged role in the 1993 World Trade Center bombing.
Iraq has also provided financial support for Palestinian terror groups, including Hamas, Islamic Jihad, the Palestine Liberation Front, and the Arab Liberation Front, and it channeled money to the families of Palestinian suicide bombers. In April 2002, Iraq increased the amount of such payments from $10,000 to $25,000. Experts say that by promoting Israeli-Palestinian violence, Saddam may have hoped to make it harder for the United States to win Arab support for a campaign against Iraq.
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So Saddam paid an unsubstantiated amount of money in $25,000 increments to an unknown number of suicide bombers who would attack Israeli frontier villages? How is that an imminent threat to the U.S. again?
*: "Reportedly" by who? Is this a case of "someone said Saddam supported these guys?"
| "CFR Publications" |
What ties have been alleged between Iraq and al-Qaeda?
In October 2002, CIA Director George Tenet announced that the CIA had received uncorroborated reports that:
* Senior-level contacts between Iraq and al-Qaeda stretch back a decade.
* Iraq and al-Qaeda have discussed the provision of safe havens and reciprocal nonaggression.
* Iraq has provided training to al-Qaeda members in chemical weapons and conventional explosives.
* Al-Qaeda leaders have tried to cultivate contacts in Iraq who could help them acquire weapons of mass destruction.
* Some al-Qaeda members who fled Afghanistan took refuge in Baghdad and elsewhere in Iraq.
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These are uncorroborated reports. That means no evidence other than someone said it, basically. I can make an uncorroborated allegation that Sensen Brenner is a five-headed space alien, but that doesn't make it true.
Oh, and you both seem to have avoided the majority of my post. Are you conceding those points to me?
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Theodore Roosevelt (1918)
"The danger to political dissent is acute where the Government attempts to act under so vague a concept as the power to protect "domestic security." Given the difficulty of defining the domestic security interest, the danger of abuse in acting to protect that interest becomes apparent. --U.S. Supreme Court decision (407 U.S. 297 (1972)
The Liberal Media At Work
An objective look at media partisanship
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162127 is a reply to message #162037] |
Wed, 29 June 2005 13:12 |
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Jecht
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conceding what? its a public forum, get over yourself. fine, if you want me to, I will. We made loud noise made them go crazy and whatnot, thats much worse than sawing off someones head with a dull blade while their still alive.
also, you still seem to be missing the point. Mr. Bush said we were to wage a war on TERRORISM. When in his speeches did he once say: "but we are limiting our aggression on those terrorists who have only just recently attacked or may be an immediate threat to us."
and to ask the question, does the end justify the means? Ask the Iraqis, they might be able to give you that answer.
| "SFE" |
Hitler was an immediate threat to us, though, what with his being allied with Japan, Japan attacking us, and his attacking other countries in order to occupy them and kill non-Aryans. Saddam wasn't doing that.
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Sadaam has never invaded a foriegn allied country, and hes certainly never commited genocide. 
FYI, Im sure the CIA makes a point not to follow uncorroborated reports with no proof.
[Updated on: Wed, 29 June 2005 13:14] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162130 is a reply to message #162127] |
Wed, 29 June 2005 13:52 |
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SuperFlyingEngi
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| gbull wrote on Wed, 29 June 2005 16:12 |
conceding what? its a public forum, get over yourself. fine, if you want me to, I will. We made loud noise made them go crazy and whatnot, thats much worse than sawing off someones head with a dull blade while their still alive.
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Insurgents aren't Saddam's former government. And just because they do it doesn't make it ok for us to do it. Because we are carrying out torture so severe that people are dying from trauma-induced injuries. But I already said that, if you happened to miss it.
| gbull |
also, you still seem to be missing the point. Mr. Bush said we were to wage a war on TERRORISM. When in his speeches did he once say: "but we are limiting our aggression on those terrorists who have only just recently attacked or may be an immediate threat to us."
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So why was Iraq such a hotspot for terrorists, as opposed to Iran, Syria, or Saudi Arabia? Well, I guess we should rule out the House of Saud because they're such close friends with President Bush.
| gbull |
and to ask the question, does the end justify the means? Ask the Iraqis, they might be able to give you that answer.
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As a general rule, your argument has flaws if you believe the ends justify the means.
| "SFE" |
Hitler was an immediate threat to us, though, what with his being allied with Japan, Japan attacking us, and his attacking other countries in order to occupy them and kill non-Aryans. Saddam wasn't doing that.
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| gbull |
Sadaam has never invaded a foriegn allied country, and hes certainly never commited genocide.
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Remember what happened when he did do that? It's not like he was doing it again.
| gbull |
FYI, Im sure the CIA makes a point not to follow uncorroborated reports with no proof.
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Unless they're pursuing a political agenda. The CIA has a lot more problems than it used to, but that's a whole 'nother debate.
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Theodore Roosevelt (1918)
"The danger to political dissent is acute where the Government attempts to act under so vague a concept as the power to protect "domestic security." Given the difficulty of defining the domestic security interest, the danger of abuse in acting to protect that interest becomes apparent. --U.S. Supreme Court decision (407 U.S. 297 (1972)
The Liberal Media At Work
An objective look at media partisanship
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162134 is a reply to message #162037] |
Wed, 29 June 2005 15:51 |
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Jecht
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General (3 Stars) |
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Attacking the House of Saud would cause a Jihad upon Global levels.
| "SFE" |
Remember what happened when he did do that? It's not like he was doing it again.
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Nothing? to him anyway.
Severe Torture....You could've called my football camp severe torture. Not to mention your sources say we have 30,000 entered into the system, 108 have died. It is clear to me this article is severely bias, among some of the "sub-sources" These are some of the ways these people died:
| "The Associated Press" |
_Obeed Hethere Radad, Tikrit, Iraq, Sept. 11, 2003. Soldier discharged for voluntary manslaughter for not warning escaping prisoner before shooting him.
_Karim Hassan, 36, Kufa, Iraq, May 21, 2004. Capt. Rogelio Maynulet, 1st Armored Division, facing court-martial over what he described as mercy killing of wounded Iraq militiaman.
_Unidentified person, 16, Sadr City, Iraq, Aug. 18, 2004. Staff Sgt. Johnny M. Horne Jr., Fort Riley, Kan., sentenced to three years in prison in another purported mercy killing. Staff Sgt. Cardenas J. Alban, also from Fort Riley, convicted and sentenced to one year confinement.
_Musa Abbas Farhan, Abu Ghraib, April 10, 2003. Shot during riot.
_Khalid Abbas Mahmood, Abu Ghraib, April 10, 2003. Shot during riot.
_Yasiree Ahmes Al-Haddii, Umm Qasr, Iraq, April 18, 2003. Shot during unrest.
_Unidentified person, Camp Cropper, Iraq, June 12, 2003. Shot trying to escape.
_Ala-Jassem Sa'ad, 22, Abu Ghraib, June 13, 2003. Shot during riot.
_Unidentifed person, Camp Bucca, Iraq, Sept. 22, 2003. Shot during riot.
_Jussayn Ali Salman, about 34, Abu Ghraib, Nov. 24, 2003. Shot during riot.
_Raed Shalaan, about 25, Nov. 24, 2003. Shot during riot.
_Madoor Hussein Sayar, about 21, Abu Ghraib, Nov. 24, 2003. Shot during riot.
_Dawood Mazin Thawin, about 25, Abu Ghraib, Nov. 24, 2003. Shot during riot.
_Naif Sliman Amir, Abu Ghraib, March 28, 2004. Shot during riot.
_Fahin Ali Gumaa, 44, April 28, 2004. Shot in fighting before capture, died in custody.
_Sajid Kadhim Bori al-Bawi, May 17, 2004, Baghdad. Shot during a raid.
_Ibrahim Hamadan Sudhail, May 24, 2004, Abu Ghraib. Shot in fighting before capture, died in custody.
_Fras Moazahim Habib, Abu Ghraib, Aug. 18, 2004. Shot during riot.
_Husham Nafit Ghafar, Abu Ghraib, Aug. 18, 2004. Shot during riot.
_Four unidentified, Camp Bucca, Jan. 31, 2005. Killed during riot.
Prisoners killed in insurgent attack on Abu Ghraib, April 6, 2004
_Karim Masnadane
_Hasan Hamad Abu Nasser
_Ahmed Selfeegi Gaer
_Ismael Abduslhussein Shahab
_Khudair Museif Jassem
_Awad Salih Jassim
_Khalaf Najif Jassem
_Andan Abdulhussein Shahab
_Fourteen unidentified.
Natural causes or accident:
_Unidentified male, Kabul, 2002. Justice Department, CIA investigated, but no prosecution.
_Mohammed Hussain Basim, July 12, 2003. Iraq.
_Mohamed Najem Abed, Aug. 6, 2003, Abu Ghraib prison.
_Twfeek Najm Byatay Al-Zubydy Hamza Hassad, Aug. 7, 2003, Diwania.
_Wathik Mihdy, Aug. 11, 2003, Abu Ghraib.
_Dham Spah, Aug. 13, 2003, Abu Ghraib.
_Ehad Kazam Taled, Aug. 20, 2003, Abu Ghraib.
_Tariq Zaid Mohamed, Aug. 22, 2003. Iraq.
_Abureda Lafta Abdul Kareem, 44, Dec. 9, 2003, Mosul, Iraq. Died while bound and blindfolded.
_Nasef J. Ibrahim, 63, Jan. 8, 2004, Abu Ghraib.
_Bakir Yassen Rashed Al Hussen, Jan. 16, 2004. Iraq.
_Hassan Ekab Ahmed, Feb. 8, 2004, Tikrit.
_Saad Mohammed Abdullah, 54, Feb. 19, 2004, Abu Ghraib.
_Mohamed Abul Abbas, 55, March 8, 2004, Camp Cropper.
_Fathel Ibrahim Mahmood, April 19, 2004, Abu Ghraib.
_Abbas Alwad Fadil, April 19, 2004, Abu Ghraib.
_Hussein Abdullah Awad al-Juwadi, 75, May 11, 2004, Abu Ghraib.
_Abduhl Kaddim Altia, May 22, 2004, Abu Ghraib.
_Riadh Mohammed Abd al Razak, June 10, 2004, Abu Ghraib.
_Sher Mohammed Khan, Sept. 25, 2004, Salerno Firebase, Afghanistan.
_Mohammed Nahar, 71, October 2004, Qaim. Investigated by Navy.
_At least 8 more investigated by U.S. Army.
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[Updated on: Wed, 29 June 2005 16:08] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162149 is a reply to message #162037] |
Wed, 29 June 2005 19:42 |
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SuperFlyingEngi
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General (1 Star) |
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2,000+ Americans [and many more Iraqis] haven't died from you wearing your hat inside.
| gbull |
Attacking the House of Saud would cause a Jihad upon Global levels.
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I doubt there are many jihadists who aren't already fighting us.
Oh, and gbull, could I see that AP article?
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Theodore Roosevelt (1918)
"The danger to political dissent is acute where the Government attempts to act under so vague a concept as the power to protect "domestic security." Given the difficulty of defining the domestic security interest, the danger of abuse in acting to protect that interest becomes apparent. --U.S. Supreme Court decision (407 U.S. 297 (1972)
The Liberal Media At Work
An objective look at media partisanship
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162157 is a reply to message #162037] |
Thu, 30 June 2005 00:00 |
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Hydra
Messages: 827
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Location: Atlanta, GA
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Colonel |
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| SuperFlyingEngi wrote on Tue, 28 June 2005 23:02 |
Doubtlessly most of you haven't heard of the Downing Street Memos, because a majority of you don't know anything.
http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/dsmemo.pdf
They're a secret British document that got leaked by someone high up in the English government telling how facts of the Iraq war were being fixed around the case and that the Attorney General said the war in Iraq would be illegal given current evidence.
http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/
A site by David Swanson, a constitutional scholar calling for the impeachment of George W. Bush. Maybe you should look around.
Here's a letter to Rep. John Conyers, Jr. from John Bonifaz, another important item.
http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/?q=node/5
"One of the keys to being seen as a great leader is to be seen as a commander-in-chief. My father had all this political capital built up when he drove the Iraqis out of Kuwait and he wasted it. If I have a chance to invade·.if I had that much capital, I'm not going to waste it. I'm going to get everything passed that I want to get passed and I'm going to have a successful presidency."
-George W. Bush, 1999, talking to his ghost writer, Mickey Herrskowitz, who wrote A Charge To Keep.
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You're quite frankly boring me; I've had enough of your slanders for a while. Good day.
Walter Keith Koester: September 22, 1962 - March 15, 2005
God be with you, Uncle Wally.
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162175 is a reply to message #162153] |
Thu, 30 June 2005 08:16 |
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SuperFlyingEngi
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| gbull wrote on Wed, 29 June 2005 23:56 |
you'd prolly be surprised.
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Well, actually, you might be right. I bet a lot of anti-Israeli soldiers and bombers would move out of Palestine towards Saudi Arabia. And then, attacking Saudi Arabia is a bad idea too, just because they have a huge army to protect their oil pipelines.
Ah, I see, you left out all the ones where they did die from torture. And "accidental" death during torture is still death during torture.
| hydra |
You're quite frankly boring me; I've had enough of your slanders for a while. Good day.
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Congratulations on your innate skills of copy & paste.
| ACK |
[SuperFlyingEngi, the smartest human ever,] is getting pretty desparate now. I can just sense it in his words. I'm waiting for him to totally lose it and freak out in a few months.
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Oh no, you read my mind with your crystal ball. Just don't shoot invisible lasers at me with it, ok?
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Theodore Roosevelt (1918)
"The danger to political dissent is acute where the Government attempts to act under so vague a concept as the power to protect "domestic security." Given the difficulty of defining the domestic security interest, the danger of abuse in acting to protect that interest becomes apparent. --U.S. Supreme Court decision (407 U.S. 297 (1972)
The Liberal Media At Work
An objective look at media partisanship
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162178 is a reply to message #162175] |
Thu, 30 June 2005 08:49 |
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Jecht
Messages: 3156
Registered: September 2004
Karma: 0
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General (3 Stars) |
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| SuperFlyingEngi wrote on Thu, 30 June 2005 10:46 |
| gbull wrote on Wed, 29 June 2005 23:56 |
you'd prolly be surprised.
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Well, actually, you might be right. I bet a lot of anti-Israeli soldiers and bombers would move out of Palestine towards Saudi Arabia. And then, attacking Saudi Arabia is a bad idea too, just because they have a huge army to protect their oil pipelines.
Ah, I see, you left out all the ones where they did die from torture. And "accidental" death during torture is still death during torture.
| hydra |
You're quite frankly boring me; I've had enough of your slanders for a while. Good day.
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Congratulations on your innate skills of copy & paste.
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What does their oil have to do with anything?
And calling those interrogations "torture" is subjective. FYI, only 2 died during interogation according to that site. 2 out of 30,000. In other words, .000006%. Whats the percentage of US soldiers living during interrogation when their captured by Insurgents?
[Updated on: Thu, 30 June 2005 08:52] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162298 is a reply to message #162037] |
Fri, 01 July 2005 20:21 |
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Hydra
Messages: 827
Registered: September 2003
Location: Atlanta, GA
Karma: 0
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Colonel |
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| SuperFlyingLiberalTool |
Congratulations on your innate skills of copy & paste.
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Congratulations on your elitist hypocrisy.
| Gbull |
What does their oil have to do with anything?
And calling those interrogations "torture" is subjective. FYI, only 2 died during interogation according to that site. 2 out of 30,000. In other words, .000006%. Whats the percentage of US soldiers living during interrogation when their captured by Insurgents?
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Don't you see, Gbull? American soldiers are evil and deserve to be tortured. That's why we should cut more spending for the evil American military and treat the "freedom fighter" prisoners like kings, even better than we treat our OWN soldiers!
Haven't you realized by now that America is evil, Gbull? Haven't SuperFlyingLiberalTool's arguments finally won you over yet?
Walter Keith Koester: September 22, 1962 - March 15, 2005
God be with you, Uncle Wally.
(<---New(ish) Prayer Group Forums)
(<---Archived Prayer Group Forums)
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| Re: After Downing Street [message #162348 is a reply to message #162333] |
Sat, 02 July 2005 16:04 |
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Jecht
Messages: 3156
Registered: September 2004
Karma: 0
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General (3 Stars) |
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| SEAL wrote on Sat, 02 July 2005 15:45 |
| Aircraftkiller wrote on Thu, 30 June 2005 05:01 |
Super Fungal Infection is getting pretty desparate now. I can just sense it in his words. I'm waiting for him to totally lose it and freak out in a few months.
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I really like how you changed his name around to try and give your argument that "I'm a little childish dork" feel. Good show, assclown.
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So ad hominem is only dissaproved of if AircraftKiller does it?
[Updated on: Sat, 02 July 2005 16:04] Report message to a moderator |
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