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| Survival kits? [message #134412] |
Tue, 25 January 2005 18:35   |
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Javaxcx
Messages: 1943
Registered: February 2003
Location: Canada, eh?
Karma: 0
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General (1 Star) |
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| Aircraftkiller |
It's not a law. Nations cannot answer to other nations, because then they lose their individual power.
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Wrong! Any nation can choose to leave the U.N. at any time and go on their little wars however they want to "legally." You WILLINGLY gave up your legal power to unilaterally (not true for this specific case as there was mroe than just America who invaded) invade another country. Don't like it? Pay your dues that you haven't bothered to pay, and leave.
But let's play your game for a moment. It's not a law-- but wait. Then what does that signature mean saying you'll play by those rules? Hmm... A formal contract? I'm pretty sure it's against you own law to violate a contract. That's not pulling an argument out of my ass, that's appling your own laws (like you seem to be intent on doing) on the international playground [which, back in reality, legally you cannot]).
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Nowhere in the UN charter does it say that we cannot go to war if we feel we need to, which is outlined in the framework of this nation - the leaders are to protect America and American interests and we do not need permission from anyone to do it. Otherwise we wouldn't have signed the UN charter if it took military power from us.
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Wrong again! Chapter 1 and Chapter 7 of the Charter outline you cannot do this. However, chapter 7 outlines a justification for doing this. Just FYI, Iraq didn't meet those conditions-- not even remotely.
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A crime is a crime, you're right... But this isn't a crime,
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Except you can't prove it 
Sniper Extraordinaire
Read the FUD Rules before you come in and make an ass of yourself.
All your base are belong to us.
You have no chance to survive make your time.
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| Survival kits? [message #134500] |
Wed, 26 January 2005 13:40 |
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rm5248
Messages: 1156
Registered: November 2003
Location: USA
Karma: 0
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General (1 Star) |
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Nobody enforces the damn law, so we can do pretty much whatever the fuck we want. That doesn't make it right though. Or legal.
w00t?
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| Survival kits? [message #134510] |
Wed, 26 January 2005 15:15 |
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Crimson
Messages: 7429
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Karma: 0
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General (5 Stars)
ADMINISTRATOR |
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| Javaxcx |
The "main purpose" of the U.N. isn't only to protect member states from non-member states, it's to protect member states from OTHER member states. Iraq was a member state, and so is Afghanistan.
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Actually, they are:
to save succeeding generations from the scourge of war, which twice in our lifetime has brought untold sorrow to mankind, and
to reaffirm faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person, in the equal rights of men and women and of nations large and small, and
to establish conditions under which justice and respect for the obligations arising from treaties and other sources of international law can be maintained, and
to promote social progress and better standards of life in larger freedom,
I'm the bawss.
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| Survival kits? [message #134938] |
Sat, 29 January 2005 02:23 |
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Aircraftkiller
Messages: 8213
Registered: February 2003
Karma: 0
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General (5 Stars) |
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The UN deemed it illegal? Lets check the facts, shall we?
Lets look at resolution 1441, I'll take excerpts to prove to
you its legality.
Quote from 1441:"Recognizing the threat Iraq's noncompliance
with Council resolutions and proliferation of weapons of
mass destruction and long-range missiles poses to
international peace and security,"
Quote from 1441:"Deploring the fact that Iraq has not
provided an accurate, full, final, and complete disclosure,
as required by resolution 687 (1991), of all aspects of its
programmes to develop weapons of mass destruction and
ballistic missiles with a range greater than one hundred and
fifty kilometres, and of all holdings of such weapons, their
components and production facilities and locations, as well
as all other nuclear programmes, including any which it
claims are for purposes not related to
nuclear-weapons-usable material,'
Quote from 1441:"Deploring further that Iraq repeatedly
obstructed immediate, unconditional, and unrestricted access
to sites designated by the United Nations Special Commission
(UNSCOM) and the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA),
failed to cooperate fully and unconditionally with UNSCOM
and IAEA weapons inspectors, as required by resolution 687
(1991), and ultimately ceased all cooperation with UNSCOM
and the IAEA in 1998,"
Quote from 1441:"Deploring also that the Government of Iraq
has failed to comply with its commitments pursuant to
resolution 687 (1991) with regard to terrorism, pursuant to
resolution 688 (1991) to end repression of its civilian
population and to provide access by international
humanitarian organizations to all those in need of
assistance in Iraq, and pursuant to resolutions 686 (1991),
687 (1991), and 1284 (1999) to return or cooperate in
accounting for Kuwaiti and third country nationals
wrongfully detained by Iraq, or to return Kuwaiti property
wrongfully seized by Iraq,"
Quote from 1441:"Recalling that in its resolution 687 (1991)
the Council declared that a ceasefire would be based on
acceptance by Iraq of the provisions of that resolution,
including the obligations on Iraq contained therein,"
(translation for this one: Saddam broke the fucking Persian
Gulf Peace treaty)
Quote from 1441:"4. Decides that false statements or
omissions in the declarations submitted by Iraq pursuant to
this resolution and failure by Iraq at any time to comply
with, and cooperate fully in the implementation of, this
resolution shall constitute a further material breach of
Iraq's obligations and will be reported to the Council for
assessment in accordance with paragraphs 11 and or 12 below;
11. Directs the Executive Chairman of UNMOVIC and the
Director General of the IAEA to report immediately to the
Council any interference by Iraq with inspection activities,
as well as any failure by Iraq to comply with its
disarmament obligations, including its obligations regarding
inspections under this resolution;
12. Decides to convene immediately upon receipt of a report
in accordance with paragraphs 4 or 11 above, in order to
consider the situation and the need for full compliance with
all of the relevant Council resolutions in order to secure
international peace and security;
13. Recalls, in that context, that the Council has
repeatedly warned Iraq that it will face serious
consequences as a result of its continued violations of its
obligations;"
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